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beardielover17
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« on: January 29, 2009, 10:30:07 PM » |
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I figured I would make a topic about my many experiences with tons of different substrates including particle as well as non-particle. I'll name the substrate and include a brief opinion/observation of each one followed by my rating of it on a scale of 1 to 10 (10 being the best). Hopefully this helps others who are debating which substrate to use for their beardie.
Sand (Washed Fine Playsand) When I used washed playsand I found that it didn't clump as much as the pet store sands did but was still being ingested more than it should be. It did give my dragon a chance to dig but at the same time it also made his enclosure a disaster because sand would be flung everywhere and in his food and water bowls. Even when my dragon would walk his tail would throw sand everywhere. It was always stuck in my beardie's nose and eyes also which obviously isn't good. Scooping the fecal matter out was very easy but the liquid part of the fecal matter was absorbed into the sand and couldn't be taken out like the other part of the fecal matter can be. Since I couldn't remove the liquid part of the fecal matter, it then started to create an odor inside the tank that you couldn't believe. I must say that the sand did absorb the heat very well but it was also that fact that the odor from the fecal matter was so much more pungent. Also it is pretty costly to maintain. My rating: 2
Sand (Pet Store Sands/Calci-sands) I used pet store sands before I tried the washed playsands and my opinion and observations on the pet store sands are basically exactly the same. While the pet store sands are much more aesthetically pleasing, they are also much more dangerous and annoying. Despite what the packaging says, they cannot be digested and they clump more than the washed playsand does. I tested this out by dropping a bit in a jar lid with some water and it clumped up like wet cat litter. To add to the potential danger it posed to my dragon's digestive tract, it also dyed his entire underside the color of the sand and took MONTHS to come out. I had to gently brush his underside with a soft toothbrush every time I bathed him until it finally came out. One other thing I forgot to mention with the washed playsand that also goes for the pet store sands are that it has very little traction for the dragon to get a good footing on. Pet store sands are much more coarse compared to washed playsand which I would imagine would be uncomfortable for the dragon. More costly to maintain than washed playsand. My rating: 1
Crushed Walnut Shells Back when I was just getting into bearded dragons my boyfriend at the time had one as well (Magellan's sister) and he told me to try the crushed walnut shells because a pet store worker told him that it was the best thing to use. So being uneducated I tried it. I only used it for a week before I became fed up with it and got rid of it. It was messy and got kicked up everywhere just like the sand did. It was much more coarse than the sands were and the chunks were much larger than the grains of sand which obviously would pose a bigger problem than the sand would. Just by touching it you can imagine how rough it would feel going down an esophagus and how easy it would be to tear the insides of the dragon which is what made me want to get rid of it immediately. Scooping fecal matter was simple for the actual formed parts of the poo but as for the liquid it just sank to the bottom of the tank and only absorbed a little into the pieces of walnut. Like the sand as well it didn't provide much traction for the dragon although it was a tad bit better compared to the sand in that aspect. Costly to maintain especially because it comes from pet stores. My rating: 1
Desert Snow There are many T-Rex brand substrates but I have only used 2 of them which I will talk about now. On each bag/package of the T-Rex brand substrates you will find a "convenient" chart on the back that tells you which type of their substrates are suitable for which animals/reptiles. Let me tell you, just by seeing which substrates they had and just using common sense you can tell that just about everything on that chart is wrong/false. The first of their substrates that I used was the Desert Snow. Desert Snow was what Magellan was originally housed on from the time he came out of the egg to a a week or two of him being under my care. Desert Snow is nothing more than what feels like a soft recycled paper. It's white in appearance and rather large chunks too. I found it to be very dusty and very difficult to "spot clean". The fecal matter, liquid and all was absorbed into the substrate which made it look filthy very quickly. I must say though, it did not create that bad of an odor like the other particle substrates nor was it coarse like the others but the fact that it was dusty made me think of it possibly causing respiratory problems and/or eye problems. It was always getting into Magellan's mouth when I would feed him crickets in his enclosure so I was contantly stopping him mid munch to remove the bedding so he didn't choke which seemed like it could happen fairly easy with it. the Desert Snow would act like a sponge when wet and get larger when wet which we all know what that would look like in the digestive tract of a dragon. It was then that I decided to try a different T-rex substrate, Sani-chips. Costly to maintain My rating: 1
Sani-Chips My next substrate to discuss will be T-Rex Sani-chips. Sani-chips are nothing more than flat, sharp, square wooden chips. That alone should tell you where my observations and opinions are going to go with this substrate. I don't think I have anything good to say about this substrate. It clumps pretty good but only to the solid parts of the fecal matter which makes spot cleaning somewhat easier. It gets kicked up everywhere like every particle substrate. It is definitely hazardous to any animal if its ingested. I have actually gotten a papercut-like cut on my finger from grabbing it the wrong way. Magellan only lasted on this substrate for 3 days. Costly to maintain. My rating: 1
Dirt/Playsand Mixture This substrate I used mainly as my laybox substrate but as far as particle substrates go, this one I actually somewhat approve of. Of all particle substrates this is one of the two that I have personal experience with that I somewhat approve of. A dirt/sand substrate is a more natural type of particle substrate that can be used for beardies. In the wild they encounter areas that are just like this. When making this mixture just remember to only use a small amount of sand. Using this substrate the animals can easily burrow creating caves/tunnels to go into either to escape heat or deposit eggs (in gravid females). When it's dug up it isn't as messy as the sands because it is a little more heavier than the sand as long as the dirt/sand substrate is moist. The dirt does break down a decent amount of the fecal matter and does not create as bad of an odor as the other particle substrates. It still does however pose a risk of impaction if ingested. If I had to choose a particle substrate to use this would be one of them. I still prefer non-particle substrates over particle any day. Not the most expensive to maintain but it is somewhat cheaper than the other particle substrates. My rating: 7
ZooMed Excavator Clay The other moderately ok particle substrate to use for a beardie. The Excavator Clay substrate is a fairly solid substrate despite its appearance before you mix it. In the package it can easily be mistaken for sand. During the use of this substrate I found that it doesn't hold that much of an odor as sands do and other particle substrates. Although it is solid it is still porous and absorbs liquid so it still holds bacteria. Cleaning up the solid part of the fecal matter is as easy as picking it up with a paper towel. The bad things about it are that it stains the underside of your reptile and it takes about 24 or more hours to dry and settle once it is mixed and placed into the tank. It isn't as easy to work with and mold as it makes it seem on the packaging. I personally don't find it that easy for any reptile to burrow in it because it hardens almost rock solid. It can get pretty dusty if it dries out too much so you have to occasionally moisten it and let it dry up again. It cannot get kicked up like other particle substrates since it hardens as one piece. This can get costly to maintain because it is a pet store product. My rating: 5
Textured Ceramic Tile After many and I mean MANY different substrates I have finally found something my dragons' as well as myself are satisfied with. Textured ceramic tiles are extremely easy to clean, provide good traction for your dragons and can even keep unruly nails in check. With all non-particle substrates it has no risk of impaction which is automatically a plus. While all other substrates (particle and non-particle) need to be replaced and get costly after a while, tile is a one shot deal. As long as the tile is sealed properly it never has to be replaced. Tile is non-porous once sealed so it cannot absorb any liquid or fecal matter which prevents bacteria from building up inside of it. Cleaning fecal matter is as easy as taking a baby wipe or a clorox wipe and wiping it up (followed by a wet paper towel to eliminate any left over chemicals or residue). They can be sterilized very easily by steam cleaning them. It is up to you to decide if you want to grout the tile in place or not. I chose to grout the tile in so my dragon's nails didn't get caught in the cracks. One thing about tile that can be a pain in the butt is the fact that it is very heavy. So for those who grouted the tile in place, if/when it comes time to move the tank it will be much heavier than if you hadn't grouted the tile in place because you could then remove it. Tile is a non-particle substrate that comes closest to the natural clay like soil bearded dragons are from. It is true that dragons cannot burrow or dig on tile but the dragons do not mind as long as they are provided a tight spot to hide/snuggle into. Typically dragons dig/burrow to get into a tight spot to escape from danger or heat so providing a hide will solve that problem. Tile is very cheap and easy to obtain and maintain in your beardie enclosure. It also comes in a variety of colors and sizes. My rating: 10
Non-Adhesive Shelf Liner With all of the non-particle substrates there is no risk of impaction which is a plus right away. Non-Adhesive Shelf Liner can be obtained at your local hardware store and Wal-Mart and Kmarts but is sometimes pretty difficult to come by. It usually comes in rolls for a couple dollars. It can be cleaned in the same ways as tile but unlike tile, it will have to be replaced from time to time. Shelf liner comes in all kinds of colors as well so it won't make your tank look as bland and boring. I found it in the stores twice and bought it to try it. I liked using it but it was too difficult for me to find and my dragons didn't have as much traction on it as I would've liked so I moved on to different non-particle substrates. My rating: 4
Reptile Carpet/Outdoor Carpet Reptile Carpet/Outdoor Carpet is one of my least favorite non-particle substrates. Yes it has no risk of impaction but it does harbor bacteria as much as any particle substrate does. It can have a bad odor once it has be soiled and is not a practical substrate since it needs to be cleaned as soon as it has been dirtied. The only way it is more practical to use is if you buy a large roll of Outdoor Carpet from Lowes or Home Depot and cut up several pieces for the week and wash the dirty ones and replace it with an unused piece while the other was being washed. It did provide excellent traction for my dragons however. I found it was too much of a hassle for me so I quickly decided not to use this as a substrate. My rating: 3
Paper Towels Paper towels is one of the non-particle substrates I used for quite some time and was pretty happy with. During my experiments with various substrates for Magellan I decided to try paper towels since they were easy to replace and clean and no risk of impaction. The only problem I found with it was that it got pretty costly to replace after a while and while I was still feeding Magellan in his tank, crickets would hide under the paper towel making it nearly impossible for him to get them. Paper towels got shuffled around quite a bit if it wasn't weighed down enough but provided a good rough texture to give good traction for the dragon. My rating: 5
Newspaper Newspaper is a non-particle substrate I still use today with many of my reptiles from my beardies to my iguana. Newspaper is one of the cheapest substrates to use. Newspaper most of the time is free or nearly free so replacing it is very easy and will not cost you a fortune. The newspaper doesn't give as good of traction as the paper towels but still provides enough for the dragon to move about with little to no extra work to move around the enclosure. The ink of the newspaper does rub off a little bit on the dragon but is easily removed. You can easily get the end rolls of the newspaper that has no ink to avoid the ink from rubbing off on your dragon and your hands as well. Most of the time the newspaper fits right into the enclosure without it having to be cut or folded so it makes it easy to go into the tank. My rating: 9
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"When people ask me, "How did you get interested in animals and nature?" I reply, "How on Earth did you lose your interest in animals and nature?" ~ Sir David Attenborough
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Bearded-Dragons.com Community
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« on: January 29, 2009, 10:30:07 PM » |
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Dadx2mj
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« Reply #1 on: January 30, 2009, 10:16:48 AM » |
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When I first started keeping dragons I used sand, mostly because that is what the pet store sold me. As I learned about the dangers of sand I tried other particulate substrates such as wheat bran and alfalfa pellets, mostly because I liked the way loose substrates looked. A very poor reason. My dragons decided to make the wheat bran and alfalfa it's staple diet and regardless of what I was told about them being digestible the dragon ended up impacted and it took some olive oil to get him pooping again.
I finally tried the ceramic tiles and have grown to love them. I now love the way they look and a tank with loose substrate now looks dirty to me even when the substrate is fresh. The dragons have adapted wonderfully to the tile and maintenance is so much easier.
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jbnery6465
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« Reply #2 on: January 30, 2009, 11:03:04 AM » |
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I was using the green reptile carpet in my first enclosure so I wouldn't have to worry about impaction. Then I realized that the carpet could serve as a farmhouse for bacteria (from soaking in liquid and stuff from the poop). I switched to non-adhesive shelf liner in the new enclosure and it's great. Easy to clean and replace.
I was going to use ceramic tile but didn't have the time to cut and grout. I'm using 2 natural basking stones for my basking platform. It also help grind down Randall's nails.
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zebrajanie
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« Reply #3 on: January 30, 2009, 01:44:20 PM » |
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Ceramic and sealed grout all the way ! Janie.
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alewis0890
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Allan Lewis
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« Reply #4 on: January 30, 2009, 02:12:52 PM » |
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cutting tile? pfft thats what a hammer and sidewalk is for lol.
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zebrajanie
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« Reply #5 on: January 30, 2009, 02:14:26 PM » |
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Listen to you, pffft, did you spring a leak, Allen  Janie.
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renaelafae
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Woman, do you mind?! I'm taking a bath!
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« Reply #6 on: January 31, 2009, 01:06:51 PM » |
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How exaclty do you clean shelf liners? I've tried wiping at them with my cleaning wipes, but they are still nasty. I believe someone in the old forum had said you could wash them in the washing machine.. Can I wash it with a load of laundry? Seems weird.
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renaelafae
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Woman, do you mind?! I'm taking a bath!
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« Reply #7 on: January 31, 2009, 01:36:30 PM » |
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Thanks so much 
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jbnery6465
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« Reply #8 on: February 01, 2009, 07:35:38 PM » |
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I spot clean with baby wipes also. But for the general cleaning, I'll take it out and spray/soak with a chlorine-water mixture that I made to disinfect it as much as possible. Then I rinse with water and let air dry. I accidentally put it in the dyer and set the dial to 'Normal' dry, when it came out it had shrunken and there were holes everywhere (from the exteme heat).
Is it bad to use anti-bacterial/disinfectant wipes instead of baby wipes? Assuming I would wipe it dry with a paper towel anyway?
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Fiammata
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« Reply #9 on: February 01, 2009, 08:09:48 PM » |
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As to the alfalfa... I'm not recommending to use it, but back when I tried it I learned that you can teach them not to eat something even if they like it, so you could use this trick for things around the house when they wander, too. You probably can't teach them to avoid pesticide-covered bugs they might find, but to avoid houseplants or other floor junk at least.
When I first tried the alfalfa my male decided it was food, and in all seriousness I thought it couldn't hurt him but at least had less nutritional value than his food and may soon become germy since he'd soon be poo-ing in it. So I didn't want him filling up on it. Before beardies I had amateure experience with dogs, cats, and birds, and friends who raise and breed show horses and dogs, all of which can be trained to various degrees. I decided to treat it like a cat situation since I didn't know how intelligent beardies might be, but that he at least seemed more clever than cats.
I'd place him in his terrarium filled with alfalfa, his food dish, water dish, and various furniture, and sit nearby doing something quietly on the computer. I'd sit listening and if I heard the tell-tale crunching sound of noshing pellets, I'd quickly reach in and tap him on the head, then place the food dish from wherever it was to right under his chin. The tap would NOT hurt but it would annoy (annoyance works wonders with cats!), and he would raise his head and sit there with his eyes closed for 10 seconds to a minute. If there was any partially outside of his mouth when I reached in I'd tug it out too. Then he'd resume wandering and several minutes later, I would hear more crunching. I'd come back with another tap and again place the food bowl under his chin. After a little while of this the crunches would become less frequent and more tentative, and sometimes he'd sample the food dish before moving on. Quickly, since he was still growing and had a large appetite, hunger would overpower his desire for alfalfa and he'd fill up on the food dish because that wouldn't bring any interruptions from me. I'd even offer a handheld cricket as a 'reward,' since he had no problems with eating from my hands. When he was full I knew I had a few hours before he'd start sampling things again, so I'd leave and come back slightly before that time. He started out way more tentative with the alfalfa, and while it still took a few sessions of taps and dish movements, he moved more quickly to the food dish that time. I kept this up for several days, listening in on him, and soon he lost interest in the alfalfa altogether. I'd kept him on it for a year before learning of better alternatives, and with lot's of time to keep track of him I never once saw or heard him sampling the alfalfa again. I also feed him his bugs either by hand or outside of the enclosure, so that was never a risk.
I'd have moved more quickly from the alfalfa except that... when I discovered this forum substrates were such a highly debated topic the only sure thing I could glean from it was that sand was bad, and people would keep directing anyone who asked to a link with a pic of a little beardie with a vial of pumped-out sand next to it. Does anyone remember that pic? Any other substrate, for the most part, appeared to have equal supporters and attackers, so it was hard to tell and I got a good deal on alfalfa... and it didn't have as much risk of hatching bug eggs if left unrefrigerated as things like wheat bran, or some other powdered edible thing. Anyway, he's on ceramic tiles now.
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